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United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't benef

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"Your product is weaker, your franchise is weaker, the Metacritic score will be lower"

United Front producer Dan Sochan has spoken out against the practice of holding back material to release separately as downloadable content, but conceded that waiting till after release to develop DLC has its downsides too.... read more

United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't benef

Postby BaileyBoy » 30 Oct 2012, 01:16

I should point out straight away that this little(or long depending how annoyed I get) rant is aimed only at Triple A titles. I love the indie gaming scene, keep it up you awesome devs! Now it gets serious.

Im not the first and certainly not the last to say that I don't like where the industry is heading. Why are developers suddenly feeling the need to whore their teams out for another couple of months working on DLC content?

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy some extra content comming out for my favourite titles but to be completely honest why can't developers just make a game anymore. Some people decide whether or not they buy a game just based on what the DLC schedule looks like, I mean what class of gamer is taking over the market these days if publishers are now becoming reliant on forcing the devs to shift out the extra content. I'm sure I'm not the only one in saying I miss the old days where a dev would just make their game and be done with it, maybe a patch or two, if we were lucky a sequel.

To me, Day 1 DLC that adds actual content to the game (Not just cosmetics, that's okay) is a big no-no because it means that the game I'm about to buy isn't complete. To make a rough comparison, It's like buying access into a beta with the promise of content down the line except you have to pay more for it.

And then we get on to the issue of DLC becoming shorter and shorter but remaining the same price. This is a bad comparison but I'm going to make it anyway. The Shivering Isles DLC (or expansion pack to give it its proper name) for TES4 Oblivion was a time vampire that easily added more than 20 hours (Thats more than some full price games these days) of decent content to an already massive world. This was released on XBL Marketplace a year after the release of the game for 2000 points. Then we have Saints Row 3 and it's season pass and included content comming out over a period of about four months after release. For 1600 points you got 3 planned DLC extra bits for 1600 points. For story stuff you would reckon it'd last for a reasonable amount of time considering a full playthrough of everything the game had too offer took me about 25 hours. It took only an hours worth of playing to complete all three mission sets. This is what our beloved industry is turning into, less and less content for the same price and quite frankkly it's a joke.

I wish it weren't this way but that's where the industry is going. Anyone else as worried as me? :(

Rant over now, you can complain about my spelling and grammar all you want, I was a little rushed to post this.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby Bezza89 » 30 Oct 2012, 01:54

Sorry bailey, I'm posting after not reading past your name, but for me - dlc should be very much planned but not to an extent that it screws the customer over - consider map packs, an absolute waste of money really, even Battlefield which I love has stopped doing them for free so the point of them is..... nothing except to increase the monetary value of your established franchise. Woo!

Dlc should be something that either substantially adds to the game in the form of an update - consider Metros Hardcore mode - GTAs expansions, or something created purely to exercise talent - any bethesda dlc, bioware dlc (major ones, granted) offer extended play for SP which doesn't appear to be created/cut as a last minute cash grab....... or it should offer something unique compared to the main game gameplay/storywise.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby CunningSmile » 30 Oct 2012, 11:03

Hi Bailey nice first post. Stick around, you seem like our sort of forumite.

However I do disagree with you on this point. I love DLC so long as it's well done, by which I don't mean map packs and new outfits for MP. Games development these days is done in waves like a production line and what's the point in having talented developers sitting around twiddling their thumbs waiting for the next stage in the process to QA a game or the publisher to market it? Get them working on a mini-sequel so that as soon as I finish my game there is more of it to play! If that means that there is something sitting there ready to download within a few days of release then so what? If it was something developed after the main game was finished (sometimes months before release) it doesn't mean I have to buy it straight away but it's nice to have the option.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby FishyGinger » 30 Oct 2012, 11:39

I know where you're coming from bailey rae, some dlc is very much worth it, some isn't. I've not got a problem with the moajority of it myself as anything (capcoms on disc for example) I just wouldn't buy. I reckon worst case scenario is some big boys start abusing it badly, EA and Activision if you don't think they aren't already.

They will ramp up the price for less and less and as a result smaller publishers will realise this and offer more content for less money. Then the big boys will lose out and start offering better prices. Then they'll get cocky many years down the line and we'll keep getting peaks and troughs. Or the world will end when Mothra defeats Gadzooki, brother of Godzilla, and rules with an iron...wing. Japan have seen it coming for years.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby CunningSmile » 30 Oct 2012, 12:20

FishyGinger wrote:They will ramp up the price for less and less and as a result smaller publishers will realise this and offer more content for less money. Then the big boys will lose out and start offering better prices. Then they'll get cocky many years down the line and we'll keep getting peaks and troughs. Or the world will end when Mothra defeats Gadzooki, brother of Godzilla, and rules with an iron...wing. Japan have seen it coming for years.


You off the meds again?
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby BaileyBoy » 30 Oct 2012, 13:00

Thanks for the warm welcome, nice to have conflicting opinions, makes for a good world and great discussions!

The problem with the day 1 DLC situation is that the developers are working on DLC for the days leading up to release when that time could be spent on preliminary patches to make the release that extra bit better. Take Skyrim for example (biased choice but roll with me here). They decided that rather than focus on DLC for the first week or two of release they prioritised and got all the people with nothing to do to focus mostly on bug exterminating. Did Skyrim suffer as a result of not having DLC for 6 months after release. Of course it didn't, it was on track for tonnes of awards, loads of sales and by the time the DLC came out the game was a lot more stable compared to release. This shows (to other devs and publishers) that you don't need DLC in the first week or so to keep people entertained.

And then we get on to the issue that if the devs feel the need to make DLC to keep people playing their game a week after launch, maybe we should tell them to focus on making better games that people would be more likely to make a place on their shelf for?
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby FishyGinger » 30 Oct 2012, 13:02

I'm trialing a new one, trixydixyvacsocosadine. Keeps me calm but side effects include anal-leakage, erectile dysfunction and death.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby CunningSmile » 30 Oct 2012, 13:18

FishyGinger wrote:I'm trialing a new one, trixydixyvacsocosadine. Keeps me calm but side effects include anal-leakage, erectile dysfunction and death.


I tried that one. It was only one of the many occasions on which I met my death, an experience which I never hesitate strongly to recommend.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby msbhvn » 30 Oct 2012, 14:11

FishyGinger wrote:I'm trialing a new one, trixydixyvacsocosadine. Keeps me calm but side effects include anal-leakage, erectile dysfunction and death.


I was on that for a few months, but the adult nappies were costing me a fortune. It was fun to stand in the middle of Morrisons and just let go, I'll miss that. I'm on Altransoprazolam now and the only side effect I've noticed is a sudden urge to violently stab everyone I meet, but I haven't acted on it that often, so I'm happy.
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby FishyGinger » 30 Oct 2012, 14:34

CunningSmile wrote:
FishyGinger wrote:I'm trialing a new one, trixydixyvacsocosadine. Keeps me calm but side effects include anal-leakage, erectile dysfunction and death.


I tried that one. It was only one of the many occasions on which I met my death, an experience which I never hesitate strongly to recommend.


You've watched it now haven't you :D

Is there a doctor in the fish?
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Re: United Front: cutting content for day-one DLC "doesn't b

Postby CunningSmile » 30 Oct 2012, 14:46

FishyGinger wrote:
CunningSmile wrote:I tried that one. It was only one of the many occasions on which I met my death, an experience which I never hesitate strongly to recommend.


You've watched it now haven't you :D

Is there a doctor in the fish?


I think therefore you is.

(or possibly I think, therefore we've hijacked a comments thread)
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