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Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more eroti

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MGS creator will reveal the character Quiet's CG data on Friday

Metal Gear Solid creator Hideo Kojima has taken to Twitter to explain some of the thought processes involved in creating the characters of Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain. He's also announced that he plans to reveal further details on one such character tomorrow - specifically for those planning to cosplay as her at TGS.... read more

Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more eroti

Postby ImTehBAwsss » 05 Sep 2013, 11:31

I thought we might be starting to get over this "sex sells" type thing in gaming...
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby CloudStrife 900 » 05 Sep 2013, 12:43

Hmph, I'm not sure how I feel about that. On one hand I can appreciate that cosplayers want to represent a game character, but on the other hand, is it worth numbing them down to just a belt and bra? What ever happened to empowering women in games? Female characters had a near practical lead role in gaming over the past few years, and that was done 'with' clothes. I think too much thought goes into how a character looks and how a character should look. To be frank.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby iEdwin » 05 Sep 2013, 12:46

dat ass... 8) :mrgreen:
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby Chameleon » 05 Sep 2013, 12:58

<sigh>

I think I remember an OXM article a while back asking why video games can't do proper adult storylines, and that even implied sex in games was against the 'rules' and resulted in complaints that Mary Whitehouse would have been proud of. I'm sure I said at the time that games should effectively ignore those complaints and push the boundaries, without making things gratuitous, and that there would still be a stigma until it just became (relatively) commonplace, the way sex in films has done.

Then things like this come around, and pushes back anything anyone has ever done in that regard.

Was it only this week we were discussing the role of women in the games industry, and that there needs to be more of them? "You too could be designing such important things as the intricacies of women's bottoms, and the way that lycra rides up between a character's buttocks! Those with the right aptitude could graduate to the delicate tasks of cameltoes and disproportionately large breasts."

Or just the female gamers. Maybe games like this will encourage them to go into the army and become snipers. Clearly a great workout for the gluteus maximus.

No wonder the industry has such an image problem as a male pursuit. Without being to un-PC, I know the Japanese have a reputation for taking some things to extreme, but sometimes I do despair of where they're going. I mean DoA - you know what you're going to get, but a game that looks to take itself a bit more seriously needs to drop this sort of thing and be more mature.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby SilentDark » 05 Sep 2013, 13:13

Don't see why it's an issue, as long as her character is interesting and she kicks ass I'm not really seeing a problem.

In fact isn't it inherently sexist to suggest that a woman who dresses in a sexy outfit simply cannot be taken seriously because slack jawed idiots will be starring at her and be unable to concentrate on anything other than her appearance? When shirtless Dante turned up in DMC3 nobody batted an eye.

Who needs standards when you can have double standards am I right? :wink:
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby CunningSmile » 05 Sep 2013, 13:17

Chameleon wrote:Without being to un-PC, I know the Japanese have a reputation for taking some things to extreme, but sometimes I do despair of where they're going. I mean DoA - you know what you're going to get, but a game that looks to take itself a bit more seriously needs to drop this sort of thing and be more mature.


I think this is particularly a problem because of the Japanese influence on the industry. The Western developers can talk all they like about empowering women and making them on a more equal footing in both games and development but this will keep running head long into the Japanese custom of Kawaii.

Rodent can probably give you a better explanation (it's very anime) but it basically translates as the obligation, particularly amongst young women, to be cute. It's hard to make any progress towards gender equality in an industry were one of the biggest influences is from a country where 55% of people still think women should stay at home, and over large eyes, simpering voices and vulnerability is still held up as the pinnacle of female beauty.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby OXM ETboy » 05 Sep 2013, 13:20

I think I remember an OXM article a while back asking why video games can't do proper adult storylines, and that even implied sex in games was against the 'rules' and resulted in complaints that Mary Whitehouse would have been proud of.


Link? Just out of interest.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby Metalrodent » 05 Sep 2013, 13:21

In more positive gender balance news apparently the upcoming EA Sports UFC will feature women for the first time
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby iEdwin » 05 Sep 2013, 13:29

Metalrodent wrote:In more positive gender balance news apparently the upcoming EA Sports UFC will feature women for the first time

Now, will the fuss be that we can use their breasts as punching bags? :lol:
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby Chameleon » 05 Sep 2013, 13:35

OXM ETboy wrote:
I think I remember an OXM article a while back asking why video games can't do proper adult storylines, and that even implied sex in games was against the 'rules' and resulted in complaints that Mary Whitehouse would have been proud of.


Link? Just out of interest.

I think maybe I took a little artistic license with the description, or I was partially remembering an article elsewhere but I guess the story must have been this.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby Metalrodent » 05 Sep 2013, 13:53

CunningSmile wrote:
Chameleon wrote:Without being to un-PC, I know the Japanese have a reputation for taking some things to extreme, but sometimes I do despair of where they're going. I mean DoA - you know what you're going to get, but a game that looks to take itself a bit more seriously needs to drop this sort of thing and be more mature.


I think this is particularly a problem because of the Japanese influence on the industry. The Western developers can talk all they like about empowering women and making them on a more equal footing in both games and development but this will keep running head long into the Japanese custom of Kawaii.

Rodent can probably give you a better explanation (it's very anime) but it basically translates as the obligation, particularly amongst young women, to be cute. It's hard to make any progress towards gender equality in an industry were one of the biggest influences is from a country where 55% of people still think women should stay at home, and over large eyes, simpering voices and vulnerability is still held up as the pinnacle of female beauty.

Not much to add other than that 'Kawaii' is also a term used by really annoying teeanage girls who think that using it instead of 'cute' makes them seem more japanese :lol:
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby OXM ETboy » 05 Sep 2013, 13:55

Chameleon wrote:I think maybe I took a little artistic license with the description, or I was partially remembering an article elsewhere but I guess the story must have been this.


I think you did, yes, though my conclusion does strike me as a bit strident in hindsight, so apologies for that. I wasn't arguing that games shouldn't be able to portray sex and violence - of course they should. I was taking issue with the way some developers/publishers/PR campaigns resort to sex and violence for the sake of it, or for mere commercial gain, then turn complaints about this into an argument about censorship and the artist's prerogative.

Artists should be free to express what they like, but that doesn't mean they're above reproach. To strongly challenge an artwork isn't to call for its removal - it's to continue the debate.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby Chameleon » 05 Sep 2013, 14:09

OXM ETboy wrote:I think you did, yes

Sorry about that. I was just going from memory, without looking up the previous article I was referring to. Must remember to check my facts better next time. I guess the closest to my original sentiment was probably
The merest whiff of a glimpse of an intimation of such content in videogames is enough, meanwhile, to snow PR departments under for months


I guess to put the two articles together, my response would be that, yes, video games will continue to be subject to the cultural double-standards they complained about in your previous article, when they continue to come up with the things they have in this one.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby Ciaran Hillock » 05 Sep 2013, 17:34

Just your classic case of a Japanese pervert, I swear everyone in that country has very unhealthy habits.
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Re: Kojima requested Metal Gear 5 characters be made "more e

Postby SilentDark » 05 Sep 2013, 19:58

CunningSmile wrote:
Chameleon wrote:Without being to un-PC, I know the Japanese have a reputation for taking some things to extreme, but sometimes I do despair of where they're going. I mean DoA - you know what you're going to get, but a game that looks to take itself a bit more seriously needs to drop this sort of thing and be more mature.


I think this is particularly a problem because of the Japanese influence on the industry. The Western developers can talk all they like about empowering women and making them on a more equal footing in both games and development but this will keep running head long into the Japanese custom of Kawaii.

Rodent can probably give you a better explanation (it's very anime) but it basically translates as the obligation, particularly amongst young women, to be cute. It's hard to make any progress towards gender equality in an industry were one of the biggest influences is from a country where 55% of people still think women should stay at home, and over large eyes, simpering voices and vulnerability is still held up as the pinnacle of female beauty.

I wanted to defend Japan, they have given us great female characters like Chun Li, Jill Valentine, then I remember Other M and I sit in the corner and cry for about an hour. In Kojima's defense though, most of his female characters tend to be strong and quite capable of looking after themselves. In fact in many cases it seems the sexier they are, the more badass they are.
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